The L-Space Web: The Timelines: Crystalle Carrie Cota

Crystalle Carrie Cota

February 2002

From: peg boucher murphy
Subject: crystalle carrie cota announcement
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002


carrie cota, my dear friend and a member of this community, passed away this past weekend while waiting for a liver (transplant). she has been ill for some time, but this was still a terrible shock to us all.

carrie considered you all, this group, to be a community that she was a part of, a community that she valued and where she felt valued. i promised her i would let y'all know.

her friends and family here (san francisco, usa) are trying make all the necessary arrangements while dealing with our grief and shock. none of us are regular readers of this newsgroup, so if you wish to obtain info, please email me directly.

thank you. peg

From: Richard Bos

I didn't even know she was ill. This is a shock, indeed.

From: Beth Winter


My feelings and prayers are with her soul.

*goes off to light a candle*

From: David Chapman

Nach neonach neisd a tha e a bhi seladh air ais a rithis
Cha bhi thusa mar a b'abhaist nam choinneamh air a chidhe
'S cha d'fhiach an teine oidhche gun do chmhradh 's do ghair
Chan fhaic mi thu a rithis.

Ged tha an l cho buaidheach, 's ged tha an t-ite cho breagha
'S ged tha a'ghrian a'derrsadh, 's ged tha a'mhuir cho ciuin
'S ged tha mi mar an fhaoileag, cho sona 's cho saor
Chan fhaic mi thu a rithis.

Atharrachaidh an t-saoghal mar a dh'atharraicheas an t-sde
Aon l tha a'ghlainne 'g eirigh 's an ath l tha i sios
Chunnaic mi an t-uisge 's chunnaic mi a'ghrian
Ach chan fhaic sinn do leithid a rithis.

From: MEG

The world will change
Just like the weather
One day the barometer is rising
The next day it is falling
And I have seen the rain
And I have seen the sun
But we'll never see the like of you again

Thank you David.

From: David Chapman

The first verse is the one I was really thinking of:

Isn't it strange now
Sailing back here again
You will not be here as usual
Meeting me on the pier
Of what worth the night fire
Without your conversation and laughter
I'll not see you again

From: Geoff Field

My deepest sympathies.

Carrie was one of the people I looked forward to reading on this group. She always had a headstart on many of us for knowledge of some esoteric subjects.

From: Dragon Prince

for the second time to my memory we the members of afp have to face this. the loss of one of our own.

I liked Carrie she was someone I could call a friend even though I never met her, and yes I do know of her plans to visit Europe this year. I just wish that I had had the opportunity to meet her face to face and to give her a {{{{hug}}}}

unfortunately this can't happen now.

but to Carrie, were ever I am you will be there close by.

Brett (no persona/nick)

no .sig none of mine are appropriate at this time

From: Julia Jones

Her death is a loss to this group, but a much greater loss to others. My sympathies to her friends and family.

From: Aquarion

There are afpers who I've met. Quite a few of them, in fact. And there are afpers who I would like, dearly, to meet. And that number isn't quite so high.

Carrie phoned into a cambridge meet I was at, and dispite the treble-evils of bad phone-reception, loud pub noises, and the imperfect quality of transatlantic phonecalls, we still managed to have a conversation.

I spoke to Carrie many times in query on IRC. I've been trying to compose a post to add to this, expressing how I feel. And words have let me down, so I'll stop.

She was nice.
I will miss her.


Yours faithfully,


From: Jenny Radcliffe

I'm ... shocked ...

Firstly, thank you, so much, for letting us know. I'm so glad I have a change to grieve.

My sympathies to all of you who were close to her.

We will miss her. Well, I will, anyway.

I'm so, so, sorry. :(

From: Louise MacMahon

R.I.P Carrie. You were a truly original and challenging person. Always very, very, present and alert. Clever and compassionate, funny. I will miss you Sincere condolonces to your family and friends

From: CCA

I'm very saddened to hear of Carrie's death. She was a very well-liked member of afp. She will be very much missed.

From: Arwen Lune

Goodbye, dear Carrie.

I'll remember your warmth

From: Lady Kayla

Sad news. I have no words.

From: Martin Wisse

Same here.

I did not know Carrie well enough to claim her as a friend, but I would still like to express my condolences and deepest sympathies to those who did know her better, her family and friends. I'll miss her.

From: Melody S-K

I am dreadfully saddened by the news of Carries death. Could I please extend my sympathy to all of her friends and family , thinking especially of Geoff who I know from #afp.

My thanks to peg for passing on the information

From: Ailbhe .

*stunned silence*

But it's lovely, lovely, lovely to know that she recognised the good stuff in afp. Part of the good stuff was Carrie.

From: Suzi


My thoughts to her close family and close friends. She will be missed from this community.

From: MP

Many sympathies to her friends and family. She was a model afper - patient, a regular quality contributor and always worth reading.

She will be missed.

From: Paul E. Jamison

I grieve.

From: April Goodwin-Smith

Rest in peace, Carrie. You will be missed.

My deepest sympathies to her family & friends.

From: Joy Green

I didn't know Carrie as well as I would have liked to, but I'll miss her contribution here, and on #afp.

My sympathies to those close too her, who must be bereft by her loss.

From: Mark Datko

I was stunned and tearful for many minutes when I learnt of this sad loss.

Carrie and I had a very fruitful and supportive exchange of e-mails last spring, and it makes me numb to look at some of those kind words now.

My sincere condolences to Geoff and the rest of Carrie's family and friends

From: Bluebottle

To be honest I don't think it has fully hit me yet, a few tears have been shed and I'm sure there will be a lot more before the month is out.

I counted her as a friend - a kind, caring, thoughtful person who always tried to put a smile on your face _whatever_ she was going through at the time. My fond memories will include the surprise phone calls she made, discussing her visiting Cambridge in August for (among other reasons) mine and Peter's wedding, the laughter, the efforts she made as a friend and... words fail me at this point.

My heartfelt sympathy and thanks for letting us know go out to them also.

From: Martyn Clapham

Oh bugger! :-((((

I've just got back from 4 days on site and found this.

I was very lucky in that I got to talk to her when she rang the Lancaster signing meet last year. Unfortunately, I'm not very good on the phone with people I don't know well and just sort of mumbled a few words.

What's worse is that for some reason I missed or skipped the post that told us about her liver problems, so I wasn't really aware that she was ill. Because of this, her death is a big a shock to me as when Antti Lehtola died.

All I can say is condolences to her family and friends.


Not really the time for a funny sig, I think.

From: Adrian Ogden

She made me laugh, she made me aware, she made me think. I admired her for her lucid and informed posts here, and especially for maintaining that clarity and appealing for sanity in the wake of Sept 11th, when she herself had lost friends in the tragedy.

I didn't know her well enough to love her, but well enough to be saddened that now I never will. My heartfelt condolences to all those she has left behind; my thoughts are with her and with you.

From: Andy Davison

This is why Carrie will be missed. Her voice of sanity was a breath of fresh air compared to some of the outrageous crap coming from the White House.

Bye bye Carrie. Others have said it far more eloquently than I ever could. RIP.

From: Alexander Strange

Although none of her posts made it over here that I can find, I miss her anyway (been reading Google Groups).


From: Eric Jarvis

I've been trying to find some words for the last few days and only found some tears

afp is a wonderful newsgroup...a lot of afpers are able to write things that can totally change ones view of something...even here, though, only a small number can do so consistently...Carrie was one...the world is now a smaller, uglier and less understandable place

From: Maaike

Very sad news. I leave afp for a few days, come back, start to catch up with the posts, and find this...

I will miss Carrie. I admired her eloquence, her wit, and her willingness to share her knowledge with us. I didn't know her well, but I am deeply saddened to learn of her death. My thoughts and sympathies go out to her friends and family.

From: Gideon Hallett

Good lord. She was one of the new bunch who I really would have liked to meet and talk to in person. I guess any such conversation would now be somewhat one-sided...

Ah well, thanks for the conversation, Carrie, however brief it was; thanks for the sanity, and thanks for the talk.

If anyone warrants a Clueful Merkin award, you do; even if it's a bit late, I'm afraid.


(who really doesn't know how to say anything here that wouldn't sound somewhat mawkish.)

From: Mary Messall

Very unfair.

That's all, just...

Damn it.

From: Melusine

I just got this news from Gideon. I don't know what to say, like him, that wouldn't sound mawkish, but seeing as how I had her phone number in my computer and was about to phone her this morning (I'm in SF and flying out tonight), I'm just sitting here, utterly stunned. Especially as Carrie was the deciding factor in my flying in and out of SF this week instead of LA.

Like Gideon, I really regret that I'm never going to meet her now. Considering I was hoping to at least have a phone conversation with her today... well, I can't say how I feel.

I haven't been around afp for the past few months, but I'm still an afper, who was hoping to meet another afper who I'd developed a strong respect for after our newsgroup and one telephone encounters.

There's nothing more to say really, except that my phone will be quiet, and I'm just going to have to wonder what it would have been like to meet her now.


From: John Barberio

My deepest condolences and sympathies to the family and friends. This is a big loss to us all, and we will miss her.

From: MEG

One of the newer members of the community who's contribution I greatly appreciated. I'm very sorry to read this news and offer condolences to those who knew and loved her.

a.f.p's loss is insignificant in comparison, but it's a loss all the same.

From: sanity

I never knew she was that ill, so I am shocked to hear this. My condolances.

Michel :-(

From: Marks.

I never knew she was ill at all.

I really can't find the words.


From: Flabbergast

At times like this, I curse my insufficient control of English, I never know what to say. What could I say, Carrie is dead. I'm sorry for the grief, I'm sorry for the loss, I'm sorry for those that stood closest to her. I feel sadness.

That's just not enough!

Carrie is dead, gone. I never got to know her more than from the posts on a.f.p. or from casual banter on #afp. I never really made an effort, there was always time to learn to know her some other time. Just now I have other things on my mind. I'm too busy, too caught up with my own affairs to have any further than just casual talks. But now there isn't any more time.

At the same time I feel such deep respect, both for Carrie that thought of us enough to make sure we would find out. And for Peg, to take time out from what must be a terrible time. Time to let us know. Thank you.

From: Harsh Sukthankar

I didn't even know her, being new at A.F.P. so this may be a bit half-arsed. Still, the loss of a life, any life, is a huge one and judging from the other responses here, she will be missed. Let me add my condolences to the lot.

PS After doing a google, it appears her last post on usenet was a reply to one of my messages. Make of that what you will. :-(

From: Jenny Radcliffe

I think Carrie would forgive me being flippant here and saying "ah, you must be her Usenet reincarnation ..!" ;)

From: Orjan Westin

No, Carrie would never follow up to herself. Oh, she did, didn't she?

It'd be nice to think she would come back, but until then I'll miss her.

From: OnyxFlam (Geoffrey)

I sit shock. Completely and totally in shock. I was at a pagan gathering this weekend... and that was when I found out. I wanted to say that although she has died, she is never gone. I am a devout celtic wiccan, and I believe heartily in reincarnation, and Im just cursing the lucky bastard that gets her next life.

Sometimes she was a pain... and I hated her with every fiber in my body for a lot... but I also loved her. And...I don't know what to do. I went to clean out the apartment some today, and all I could think about was the childish "I want my mommy."

Thank you all for your well wishes... it means a lot to me. More than you can imagine, probably. A memorial service will be held, and for those of you who might live in the neighborhood I will be posting info on it... For those that don't, just keep her in your thoughts then.

I'll periodically log onto #AFP, for those that don't know, I am OnyxFlam.

Blessed be, and merry part

Though the day had grown late,
The young man went to wait,
And unsteadily gazed at the sky.
As the red sun set low,
It soon caused him to know
That his last day of childhood would die.

Oh the stars swam across
The night sky with his loss,
And his father appeared in that sea.
Oh the drum of his heart
Nearly broke him apart
As he fell to the ground on one knee.

For hed come to wait
For his da at the gate
With a broken toy sword in his hand.
From beyond death he'll come,
With the beat of love's drum,
To honour his son and his land.

(Heather Alexander, Wooden Toy Sword)

From: Karen

> I went to clean out the apartment some today, and all I could think
> about was the childish "I want my mommy."

Which makes me think of this one, written for a lost Mother but works a lot more widely I find:

To write down words is not enough
Still I can try to put across
The width and the depth
of this ordinary thing
It's called a name
and that is love
Though it's hard to believe
It's an ordinary thing
It's what our lives are made up of
And therefore it must be

We must all live day out day in
We all must sleep,
we all must breathe
And all we can seek
is a way of life that is
As much as we can hope to be
Inspiration is here for all to know and see
And it is this you give to me
All that I can be

The chorus is more suited to closer people than I.

> Thank you all for your well wishes... it means a lot to me. More than
> you can imagine, probably. A memorial service will be held, and for
> those of you who might live in the neighborhood I will be posting info
> on it... For those that don't, just keep her in your thoughts then.

She hasn't left them. Like Melusine I never met her either, but had a few exchanges and felt I'd very much have liked to meet her and now I never will, and I haven't entirely got my head around it. I heard about this last week but I'm pretty limited on posting opportunities at the moment and I've been unable to post until today and yet a week on its still seems no less unreal.

But I'm conscious that my shock and sense of loss is so small compared to yours and the rest of her friends and family. Many sympathies to you all.

And many thanks to esmi for timelining this thread with the same care and thought that went into Antti's, its a particularly nice way to remember someone from this group, and it does keep them in our minds.

From: Andrea

Geoff, I wish I was there with you, I wish I could help, all I can give is words and time. These are the same things your mum gave me, she was a special friend, who I was looking forward to meeting, I will miss her very very much.

> A memorial service will be held, and for
> those of you who might live in the neighborhood I will be posting
> info on it... For those that don't, just keep her in your thoughts then.

We will be there in our thoughts, I just wish we could be there in person. Remember we are only a keyboard away, forget the miles they are just a measurment and have nothing to do with hearts closeness. You said the other day we were family and once you've chosen to adopt us we are hard to lose.

From: ingenious paradox

oh.... dear....

especial *hugs* to Geoff (I don't know you, but I know how it is)

From: Speaker-to-Customers

I had not known she was ill. She was only 11 months older than me.

It was a great shock to me too; obviously not as much as to family and real-life friends, but still a shock.

I have no words to express my sorrow and sympathy.

I do not think my Usenet nom de plume is appropriate here, so I will sign this with my real name.

Paul Johnson

From: rachel walmsley

Others have already expressed the feelings of shock, grief and sympathy that I have been feeling over this and I would like to echo their sentiments.

I'd also like to share some of my memories of Carrie. It seems appropriate to me.

I remember a while back, a somewhat heated thread, over an emotional subject where she and I were arguing on the same side. I lost my cool slightly but throughout the discussion she remained entirely calm and rational under provocation, and did a much better job of being educational and informative than I could ever be.

Pun sessions on #afp. She had a boundless enthusiasm, unflagging energy and quick wits and was always a worthy opponent in any sort of word play.

I'm smiling at the memories, but at the same time sad that they will never be repeated. I'll miss her.

From: Tiggs

I found out last night of this sad news, was shocked to start off with, then started crying as it sunk in.

I only knew Carrie for a few months, but she, as well, as several other afper mums have been an invaluable support & centre of advice for my first pregnancy.

I am saddened that Carrie will not meet Tigglet in this life, but I know she'll be smiling down on the both of us soon :)

May she rest in peace & my thoughts are with Geoff, her family & friends


From: raymond larsson

> She was nice.
> I will miss her.
> Farewell.

That is the nut, the very essence.
Me too.

From: Marie

I've just belatedly found out via the rugrat-herders list.

I knew Carrie was ill, but didn't realise how far it had progressed. I only 'knew' her online since she started posting here, but she was someone I would have loved to meet irl. Her wit and wisdom on the froup and in rugrat-herders will be sadly missed by me for one :-(

I seen to be rather lost for words, so I'll stop trying to say what I feel - others have said what I feel far more eloquently than I can atm.

My condolences and *hugs* go to her family and friends.

in deep sadness,


[I can't get one of her sigs out of my mind - 'we have enough youth, how about a fountain of SMART?']

From: peg boucher murphy
Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002

for those afp-ers who are going to be in the bay area:

A Memorial Service, for Crystalle Carrie Cota will be held for her family and friends on Saturday, March 16, 2002.

For those who wish to join us in celebrating her life and remembering her, we will gather on the beach that she loved so much.

Memorial for Crystalle Carrie Cota
March 16, 2002
Ocean Beach, just south of the N-Judah

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