From: Orin Thomas Subject: [FAQ] The Discworld Timeline Newsgroups: alt.fan.pratchett,alt.books.pratchett Summary: This document tries to provide a consistent chronology for events in the Discworld universe. Followup-To: poster Organization: Unseen University, Melbourne Campus. The Wizards of Oz. Keywords: Pratchett Discworld FAQ timeline chronology X-Autoposter: This FAQ was autoposted by X-Archive-name: pratchett/discworld-timeline X-Posting-Frequency: monthly (on the 1st) X-Last-modified: October 2000 X-Version 1.08 X-URL: Archive-name: pratchett/discworld-timeline Posting-Frequency: after the release of a new Discworld novel Last-modified: October 2000 Version 1.08 URL: THE DISCWORLD TIMELINE VERSION 1.08 The Colour of Magic - The Fifth Elephant Moderated by: Orin Thomas (orin@lspace.org) Date: October 2000 ----------------- Moderator's note: ----------------- Permission is not given by the moderator to post this on websites other than www.lspace.org. This is ultimately an evolving document from which much discussion will be generated on alt.books.pratchett. There is the possibility, given the comments of Stephen Briggs on alt.books.pratchett in March 1999, that an official time line will be forthcoming sometime in the future. I imagine that the Briggs/Pratchett publication will be somewhat different from this timeline, probably better, and I heartily recommend that you buy it. Haven't heard anything about this possible in over a year - but I continue to keep this document up to date. I also remind you that Discworld is copyright of Terry and Lyn Pratchett, that The Discworld Companion is copyright Terry Pratchett, Lynn Pratchett & Stephen Briggs and the maps are copyright those three and Stephen Player. -------------- Submissions -------------- Disagree with parts of this document? Have stuff to add? Email the quoted reference, the page number, and the change you think it makes to orin@lspace.org. You can also bring them up on ABP though I am not guaranteed to see them. -------------- Putting Years to the time spaces: The Discworld Companion has the Ankh-Morpork civil war occuring Grune 4 1688 (University Calendar). Lets draw a long bow and posit that this is in fact the civil war in which Stoneface Vimes cut off Lorenzo the Kind's Head. This would make the 300th anniversary of the civil war, mentioned as a year from now in Feet of Clay, Grune 4 1988. So lets assume that Feet of Clay takes place in Grune 1987 Now that we have a date to work from we are really cooking with gas. The events of G!G!, MP, RM, L&L, MAA, SM, IT, M!M and FOC all occur between Grune 1985 (UC) and Grune 1987 (UC). Also remember that the UC is different from the Great Year on which the city of AM dated during the empire. So the University is founded in 1 (UC). This is equivalent to AM 1282, the time near the end of the Ankh-Morpork empire. The AM year is actually equivalent to 2 years by (UC), so the beginning of the AM Empire is 2564 (BUU) [Before Unseen Uni] ---------------------- THE DISCWORLD TIMELINE YEAR (UC) EVENT -5000 Dios helps Khuft Found Djelebeybi Dios is sent back in time 7000 years in Pyramids. This may be even further back because what if Djel counts 1 year as 1 rotation of the disk. -2564 Beginning of Ankh Morpork Empire. -1013 One Sun Mirror founds the Agatean Empire with the help of the Red Army. The Great Wall is constructed. 3000 years prior to IT. -750 Reign of King Tyrell. AM 907. Possible Ancestor of Carrot who had a ring with the same inscription as found near the Dwarf mine in Lancre. MAA. 1 Unseen University Founded by Alberto Malich. 1282 AM. 14 Albert reverses Rite of Ashkente and ends up in Death's Domain. Based on Statue Date 1289 AM which is 7 great years after the Uni founded in 1282. 900 The institution of slavery begins in Ephebe. Discworld RPG reference to Slavery having been around about 1000 years. Leshp is above the sea and considered part of the Ankh-Morpork Empire. 1386 A law requiring all citizens to practice archery for at least an hour a week is passed in A-M. 1500 One of Lady Sybil's ancestors cuts off a Klatchian's head and brings it home on a pole. 1688 Stoneface Vimes Executes Lorenzo the Kind. End of Monarchy in Ankh-Morpork. DWC reference on Monarchy and Civil War. Descendants of Lorenzo banished from A-M. Movements unaccounted for until a battle in 1971, almost 300 years later, which results in Carrot being adopted by some Dwarfs. 1689 Rule of Stoneface and Ironheads ends after people vote away democratic rights. DWC. 1689 Beginning of the rule of the Patricians. DWC. 1764 Codice of Chimera kills the last Dragon. 200 years before TCOM. 1787 Birth of Vlad Magpyr. 1799 5 March. Lady Alice Venturi born. DWM. 1828 Wilhelmina Venuri dies. DWM. 1842 14 Spune. General Sir Roderick Purdeigh born. 1856 Margaret Purdeigh dies. DWM. 1857 Birth of Windle Poons. [Dies in RM, age 130] 1858 Major-General Sir Ruthven Purdeigh Dies. DWM. 1864 Viscount Venturi of Pseudopolis dies. DWM. 1878 Cohen the Barbarian is born. Is 87 at time of TLF 1881 Hwel is born. He is 102 at time of Dysk construction. WS. 1889 Cohen is chased out of village by father at age 11. TB 1897 12 Ick. Lady Alice Venturi dies. DWM. 1898 25 Sektoper. Gen. Sir Roderick Purdeigh goes missing. DWM. 1900 Vincent, later "Old Vincent", is born. IT. 1902 Caleb the Ripper is born. IT. 1914 Count Magpry is killed by Arno Veyzen. CJ. Ridcully Born. Doesn't become brown until later :-). MP 1916 Death Rescues Ysabelle and adopts her. 1932 Ysabelle reaches age 16 and stops growing older. She stays 16 for 35 years. Rincewind Born. (based on Dr Rijinswand age from alt reality) 1935 Some Wizards start reading A'Tuin's mind. All they are able to determine is that it is looking forward to something. 1938 Granny Meets Mustrum Ridcully. (50 Years before L&L). Ridcully is 24 Yrs Old. Granny Meets Queen of Elves. [Granny is older than Ridcully when they meet. I haven't pinned her age down - but in WA the suggestion is that she is around 70 or so.] 1939 Alison Weatherwax passes through Uberwald. She kills Count Magpyr. CJ. 1946 Ridcully leaves Unseen University at age 27 for a rural life. He is a level 7 Mage. 1952 Keli Born. Age 15 at time of assassination. Bethan Born. 17 at age of TLF. 1956 Death of Drum Billett. Birth of Eskarina Smith. Twoflower starts saving for his journey. 1957 Rincewind enrols at UU. He is 24. [16 years in Sourcery.] 1959 Tethys starts working at the Edge. 1961 Person later to be known as Lord Hong is born. Aged 26 in IT. 1963 Birth of Sourcerer Coin. Is 10 years old when he takes over UU. 1964 The Broken Drum burns down and becomes the Mended Drum. The events of TCOM. Esk Apprenticed to Granny Age 8 Events of The Light Fantastic. Librarian turned into an Orang-Utan Ysabell meets Twoflower and Rincewind. Cohen discusses his age with Rincewind. He is 87. Rincewind becomes assistant librarian. Nine Turning Mirrors is the Grand Vizier. The Emperor is described as an "idealistic boy" hence isn't the Emperor of IT. TCOM takes 6 Months, TLF takes 3 Months. TLF ends on Hogswatch. 1966 Granny arrives at Unseen University with Esk. 1967 Mort is apprenticed to Death. (At start of year) Mort stops assassination of Keli. Albert returns to UU and meets Rincewind and Librarian. Mort and Death Fight. (Susan returns in time and watches) 1968 Mort and Ysabelle get engaged. 1969 Events in the first part of Wyrd Sisters. Cohen arrives at Mica's Bridge in Lancre. TB Lancre and Cohen move forward in time 15 years. Mort and Ysabelle get married. Become Duke and Duchess of Sto Helit. Imp Y Celyn is born. Age 18 at time of SM. 1970 Carrot Ironfoundersson Born. Age 16 at time of G!G!. 1971 Susan Sto Helit is born. [16 years before SM] 1973 Events in Sourcery. (Spring in AM) Rincewind Enters Dungeon Dimensions. 1975 Cruces is a tutor at the Assasins Guild. He tutors Pteppic. 1976 Events of Pyramids. Starts in Summer, and takes 3 months. Pteppic meets Xeno of Ephebe. 1978 Last pointless Albatross from Agatean Empire arrives at A-M. Vetinari appears to be Patrician at the time. 1979 Events from ERIC. Rincewind escapes from Dungeon Dimensions. The Archchancellor in Eric's time was Ezrolith Churn - Eric page 10. The countries of Elhab and Smale reach a ceasefire. The grandmother of Piotr Hans, of Escrow in Uberwald, dies. 1980 Rincewind ends up travelling around for next few years. He runs away from many things in his search for safe boredom. 1983 Vitoller Builds the Dysk. 1984 Lancre emerges from Timeslip. Cohen after his conversation with Mica, decides to do something really big and begins his journey towards the counterweight continent. Leonard of Quirm goes missing. 1985 Witches head off for Genua. [WA] Autumn. Deccan Ribobe Dies, the last Keeper of the Door. Grune. Carrot Arrives in Ankh Morpork. Events of Guards! Guards! Based on Carrot having been in A-M almost 2 years at FOC. Ridcully summoned from estate to Unseen University ArchChancellorship. Alchemists perfect film. Events of Moving Pictures. Witches see the Elephant Events of Reaper Man Year of Notional Serpent. Two months according to text. Carrot promoted to Corporal. Rincewind, after years of running every which way, ends up trapped on an island. Events of Small Gods. Year of Notional Serpent. Brutha meets Xeno of Ephebe. Death of Rats appears in boat. 1986 Events of Lords and Ladies Dr. Cruces becomes head of Assassins Guild. Date speculative. Perhaps has been head of guild for a while .. but definitely before MAA. Mericet, also mentioned in Pyramids with Cruces is around the guild at this time as well. Note reference to Cruces in DWC. Men at Arms (Men At Arms) Carrot promoted to Watch Captain at age of 17. Soul Music Ridcully is about 72 Intersting Times Summer. 1987 Maskarade Grune. FOC. The Sea and Little Fishes 1988 Grune. 300th Anniversary of AM Civil War. Jingo Hogfather Carpe Jugulum The Last Continent. Wizards travel Home. 1989 The Science of the Discworld Vimes travels to Uberwald. The Fifth Elephant. 2001 Century of the ...... Cobra? I distinctly remember someone showing me it was something else. 2015 Librarian travels back in time through lspace to 1985 to rescue books from great fire of Ephebe. (anyone note the years and their correltation with a certain trilogy of movies?) ------ NOTES: ------------------ CHARACTER TRACERS. ------------------ The easiest way to work all this out is to trace the characters ages, or the ages of the people that they meet. Cohen is 87 in TLF and 95 in IT. TLF -> IT = 8 years. If Cohen's time line exists without some form of interruption in this way it causes a whole lot of problems which I have deemed the "Rincewind/Soul Music" paradox. Let me explain: Rincewind's TIMELINE intersects Ridcully's at IT, 8 year after TLF. However Ridcully cannot be Archchancellor until a lot longer than 8 years after TLF. Ridcully doesn't become Archchancellor until MP. He isn't AC in G!G! yet he is at the time of MAA and FOC. There's less than two years between G!G! and FoC, but presumably more than one. In FoC, Vimes reflects that two years earlier someone like Willikins the butler would have let him in the (Ramkin) kitchen only on sufferance. There's also a comment about it saying a lot about Carrot that even after almost two years in Ankh-Morpork he is uneasy about writing the word d*mned, even with the '*'. Both references are in the first few pages of FoC (Vimes shaving, Carrot writing home over breakfast with something wolf- shaped under the table eating scraps). G!G! -> FOC = < 2 Years. G!G! -> MAA -> FOC = < 2 Years. In G!G! Lady Ramkin says "The Duke of Sto Helit is looking for a guard Captain, I'm sure. I'll write you a letter. You'll like them, they're a very nice young couple." which places G!G! between Mort and SM. Mort -> G!G! -> SM = > 16 years. In Soul Music Carrot has reached the rank of Captain. Imp's career takes place after Carrot becomes Watch Captain, as Carrot had installed the quiz machine in the Drum - SM page 71. This rank remains until at least the events of Jingo. At the end of FOC Vimes is made a Knight and at the end of Jingo he is made a Duke. It is reasonable to assume about a 1 year separation between FOC and Jingo. FOC -> Jingo = 1 Year. Looking at Watch ranks alone, the sequence must be G!G!, MAA, SM,FoC. At end MAA, Detritus is acting Constable, Carrot is becoming Captain. In SM, Detritus is Constable (see piano-nicking exercise shortly after first gig in Drum), and Carrot is Captain (see pre-gig description of his downright unconstitutional abuse of the Quizzing machine). In FoC, Detritus has made Sergeant. MP takes place after G!G! because Ridcully becomes AC in MP and isn't AC in G!G!. Because Windle Poons stays the same age in MP and RM, and we know that there are just less than 2 years between G!G! and FOC. Because Detritus is a Constable in SM and then a Sergeant in FOC we also know that SM fits in there somewhere. G!G -> MP -> RM -> MAA -> SM -> FOC = > 2 years. Okay so this establishes that SM occurs between MAA and FOC. Ridcully is AC in SM and MAA so we know that MP occurs between G!G! and MAA. In TLF Ysabell is still living alone with Death. Let's assume that Mort's apprenticeship started a year later, and Susan was born two years after the events of MORT. [This does bring up the interesting question of Mort's age at the birth of Susan. It also brings up the interesting side issue that Susan has not taken on duties as the Duchess of Sto Helit at age 16 because she seems to "young" for the position. But how old was Mort when he took them on?] Susan is sixteen when we take up her story hence the events of SM must take place at least 16 years after MORT. So we have the great rush of novels that occur at least 16, perhaps even 18 or 20 years *after* TLF. That Ridcully does not become Archchancellor until 18 to 20 years after TLF. Given that Cohen's age suggest that 8 year have passed between TLF and IT this means that the events in SM occur SM 10 years _after_ those of IT. Mort and Ysabell died only a short time, say 9 months, before the main events of SM. TLF -> Mort = 0-2 years. Mort -> SM = > 17 years. TLF -> SM = > 18 years. hence IT -> SM = > 10 years. See the problem? Ridcully *needs* to be AC a whole lot earlier than he can possibly be because of Susan's age. The Mort -> SM distance is also confirmed as being about 17 years on page 147 of the corgi edition. But there is a creative solution. It was postulated (as a cruel joke I might add :-) that Cohen could have been stuck in the Lancre time slip. Though there is no *direct* evidence of this, we know that Cohen visits the Lancre area in the short Story "Troll Bridge". It provides a solution for us which allows the time between TLF to become: TLF -> TB -> IT = 23 years [8 years subjective for Cohen] We had no latitude to bring the events in Soul Music backwards beyond a specific point because we were constrained by Susan's Age. However we do have latitude to space things out a bit so that Soul Music occurs more than 16 years after Mort, and much more than 18 or so years after TLF. Lets say that there is 2 years between TLF and MORT. How long do the events in MORT last? Perhaps 3 or so Months, depends on how long it takes Keli to organise a coronation - but probably not all that long. Now Ysabelle is 16 in TLF and MORT (because of the properties of Death's Domain) ... Mort is probably younger at the tim of MORT - but lets be generous and say Mort is the same age as Ysabelle. Lets assume it takes them a year to fall in love and another year to get married (these royal weddings take time to organise darlings). That they take over the duties of the duchy at the time of their wedding (so they are about 18) and that 2 years later Susan is born. so revised this comes as TLF -> M = 2 years M -> Wedding = 2 years. Wedding -> Susan = 2 years. Susan's Birth -> SM = 16 years. TLF -> SM = 22 years. ER comes before WS. We know in WS that 15 years passes. We also know that when Granny visits the University in ER the librarian is an orang-utan (p 146). Hence ER is after TLF. We also know that the END of WS is at least 15 years after TLF. Given Cohen's age difference between TLF and IT it is safe to assume that events during the Rincewind books including TLC occur in the timeslip between the start and end of WS. TLF -> ER = 1 years. ER -> WS(St) = 3 years. WS(st) -> WS(fin) = 15 years. hence TLF -> WS(fin) = > 19 years WS(fin) -> WA = > 2 years WA -> L&L = > 1 year Hence TLF -> L&L = 22 years Which is good enough to allow Ridcully to come to the Wedding of Magrat and Verence. L&L -> M!M = > 3 Months. M!M -> CJ = > 1 year [TSALF occurs in this period] Hence TLF -> M!M = > 20 Years TLF -> CJ = > 21 Years THE SMALL GODS QUESTION. When did Small Gods occur. The prevailing wisdom has it that it occurred some time before the events of the main chronicles. Two sets of character links falsify this hypothesis. The philosophers from Pyramids appear in Small Gods. The final clincher is the fact that both Reaper Man and Small Gods occur, according to the texts, in the Year of the Notional Serpent. Dr Cruces appears in Pyramids and MAA. Hence Small Gods is tied to the same era as MAA. This allows the Death of Rats (created in Reaper Man) to exist during Small Gods. This also means that the librarian didn't need an lspace time portal, just a space portal, to rescue books from the library. I think that Small Gods comes after Pyramids, in part due to the appearance of a Djelibeybian contingent in the fleet that attacked Omnia at the end of the book: would a pre-Pyramids Djelibeybi have taken part in such a war? [granted an extremely pre-period one would but not the one we see at the opening of Pyramids]. The century is also confirmed as being the century of the fruitbat. A quotation with reguards to the Librarian and the Fire seems to suggest that the Librarian "travelled back in time" to the fire. I see no problem with this. As the bulk of the novel conclusively takes place in the year of the notional serpent, century of the fruitbat - the librarian only has to travel from a point where that year "appears in the history books". I've assumed 30 years hence for the purposes of the timeline. VETINARI The exact start of Lord Vetinari's reign is unclear. Some postulate that he was Patrician In TCOM, though this patrician sounds very fat excessive in his tastes. Death is celebrating the 10th anniversary of the ascension of a patrician in Mort - but not necessarily Vetinari. The Next Century? At the end of Pyramids , Gern tells Dil that they are now in the Century of the Cobra rather than the Fruitbat (P page 267) However we also know that the century after the Fruitbat is the century of the "Orin has Forgotten" according to Verence's comments in CJ. The Century of the Cobra might have been an earlier century - perhaps when Khuft founded Djelebeybi. -------- CREDITS. ------- The following people contributed to the original Timeline threads during 1995. Sam Kington) Alex Ridge (Adrian Michael Wragg) (Andrew John Towers)(Carl Muckenhoupt) (Sebastian Weinberg) (Markus Imhof) Ben Of Bens Ben Summers (Colm Buckley) (Craig MJ Slee) (Gareth D Layzell)David J Morris wrote: k (Michael Dimmick) (Emmet O'Brien) k (Mr B F Bjornsson) (Casey Richardson) (Tony Finch) (Glenn Brady) (James Brokaw) Helen Highwater (Henri Karrenbeld) James Allen James Gater (James Allen) Jayne Gleed Jimmy Brokaw (Joann L Dominik) John C. Kirk (John Rayment) (Lady Kayla) Lee Staniforth (Leo Breebaart) (CyberCat) Marc Oldenhof > Matthew Cooper Mike Putnan ("Richard Shearwood") Orin Thomas (Phil Boswell)("ppint.") Richard Kettlewell ("Rupert Morrish") Rob Cotterill > (Rocky Frisco)Roger Barnett Ryberg (Sichel, John) Stephen Wilson Suzi Svend Andersen(Archangel) Terry Pratchett Tom Wheeley (Vivek Dasmohapatra)(John Wilkins) William James Booth The following people have contributed in the 1999 version: MSN, Tamar, Tom Walsh, Michael, Andrew Janssen, Dylan O'Donnell, Leo Barium, Chris Connelly, Raphael Kirchke, Michael UU, Miq, Hans Manus, Paul Vourey. -- Orin Thomas orin@lspace.org